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Old 05-10-2017, 06:26 PM   #21
BallisticSquid
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Am I the only one that had to look up Pedantic ? LOL

Ped meaning foot & antic meaning grotesque.....Squid, you better have a doctor look at that foot !!!
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Me too! LOL!
Who would have though Family Guy could be so educational!!

After seeing this episode, the word stuck with me.

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Old 05-10-2017, 06:33 PM   #22
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Your teacher had you do that?
No. Just a joke

Also, no teacher so it would have been self inflicted.
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Old 05-10-2017, 06:50 PM   #23
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It gets tricky when you tell the piano player what chord you are playing at a certain spot...he knows not of this capo thing...you have to tell him the actual chord you are sounding out.
I mostly play with other instruments, and I write a lot of lead sheets so I generally think in terms of the chord tones instead of the chord shapes. A big plus is that it really helps you to learn the fretboard!
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Old 05-11-2017, 02:11 AM   #24
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Ok, I am trying to get a better grasp on what a capo is doing, so here goes:

The notes on the first fret are F, C, G#, D#, A#, F.

If you play an open E chord, you will get the notes open string E, open string B, G#, E, B, open string E (022100).

So forming that open E-shape chord gives you an E major chord.

Then you place a capo on the first fret, and then the notes in the first fret of the guitar (1st fret after the capo, second physical fret of the guitar) are now G, D, A#, F, C, G. So if you play the same E chord shape, the notes played are G, D, A#, C#, F#, G.

The notes were shifted one semi-tone by the capo, and just the open strings are now: F, C, G#, D#, A#, F.

So while you can just shift a triad to hit the notes you want to play, a capo means the open strings are also moved so that an open chord can be played knowing that they are within the major scale you are playing.

The problem I've seen for EVERY explanation on the web about what using a capo does is that they do not show the notes of the fingered chord AFTER the capo is placed, so I wanted to confirm the before/after effect of the capo on the guitar neck.
A couple of things.

First, when spelling out a chord with the strings ordered horizontally, common practice is that they are listed 6th-->1st strings, lowest to highest
left to right, opposite what you've done.

Second, all a capo does is effectively shorten the neck by "moving" the nut up (toward the bridge) a half-step with each fret. That's it. Playing open "cowboy" chords in the same relative position to the capo as you would at the nut gives you the same open chords + the number of frets/half-steps you've placed the capo. You simply "pretend" the capo is the nut.

Example: capo at the 3rd fret, every open chord is now modulated up 3 semi-tones/half-steps. Open E-shape chord fingered 6th--->1st strings - 0 5 5 4 0 0 - is now a G chord (G D G B D G). Open A shape fingered x 0 5 5 5 0 is now a C chord (x C G C E G).

As you learn the fretboard and chord intervals the "translations" become automatic.
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Old 05-12-2017, 12:06 AM   #25
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A couple of things. First, when spelling out a chord with the strings ordered horizontally, common practice is that they are listed 6th-->1st strings, lowest to highest left to right, opposite what you've done.
I'm using a lefthanded guitar so they are in the opposite order to me.

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Second, all a capo does is effectively shorten the neck by "moving" the nut up (toward the bridge) a half-step with each fret. That's it. Playing open "cowboy" chords in the same relative position to the capo as you would at the nut gives you the same open chords + the number of frets/half-steps you've placed the capo. You simply "pretend" the capo is the nut.

Example: capo at the 3rd fret, every open chord is now modulated up 3 semi-tones/half-steps. Open E-shape chord fingered 6th--->1st strings - 0 5 5 4 0 0 - is now a G chord (G D G B D G). Open A shape fingered x 0 5 5 5 0 is now a C chord (x C G C E G).
The notes on the fifth fret are A-E-C-G-D-A so if I don't use a capo but use a triad on E-C-G on the fifth fret and mute the other strings, I assume I can accomplish the same thing.
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Old 05-12-2017, 03:37 PM   #26
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Then you place a capo on the first fret, and then the notes in the first fret of the guitar (1st fret after the capo, second physical fret of the guitar) are now G, D, A#, F, C, G.
I don't think this correct. The notes at the first fret of the guitar (1st fret after the capo, second physical fret of the guitar) are F#, C#, A, E, B, F#.

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So if you play the same E chord shape, the notes played are G, D, A#, C#, F#, G.
I don't think this correct either. If you play the same E chord shape, the notes played are F, C, A, F, C, F (i.e. an F-chord).
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Old 05-12-2017, 07:53 PM   #27
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The notes at the first fret of the guitar (1st fret after the capo, second physical fret of the guitar) are F#, C#, A, E, B, F#.
Correct.

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If you play the same E chord shape, the notes played are F, C, A, F, C, F (i.e. an F-chord).
Also correct. This is where understanding CAGED helps. You can play any any chord with any shape, you just have to know *where*. The more you use a capo and do the transcription, the easier it gets. I see a lot of guitar players who don't need to communicate with other musicians on different instruments fail at the transcription part.
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Old 05-12-2017, 08:36 PM   #28
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Yeah, lots of times you'll see a half step up key change on the last verse for emphasis, and the guitar player will just move the capo up one fret rather than reposition the chords.
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Old 05-12-2017, 10:18 PM   #29
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I'm using a lefthanded guitar so they are in the opposite order to me.



The notes on the fifth fret are A-E-C-G-D-A so if I don't use a capo but use a triad on E-C-G on the fifth fret and mute the other strings, I assume I can accomplish the same thing.
It's still a good idea to stick to convention, even if you are left handed as it avoids confusion.


Yes, that triad is correct, but capos are used to take advantage of the open strings while finding a key that suits the vocalist, chord voicings that suit the music, optimum pitch of the instrument, or shorten the scale for long reaches.
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Old 05-25-2017, 04:57 PM   #30
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It's still a good idea to stick to convention, even if you are left handed as it avoids confusion.

Yes, that triad is correct, but capos are used to take advantage of the open strings while finding a key that suits the vocalist, chord voicings that suit the music, optimum pitch of the instrument, or shorten the scale for long reaches.
This might be the answer but only partially in that if, instead of applying a capo on the second fret you just play the D-chord shape on the bottom 3 strings which would now be that E chord - played without the capo as X-X-X-4-5-4?

It would be what I call a "shape 2" triad (d-shape triad) and you'd still have the E-chord?

I guess because I've had Justin drill into my head the importance of muting strings that aren't being played to a great degree, so that unless I'm playing open chords in the first three frets (G, C, D, A, E, B7, etc) then everything else is an E or A-shaped bar chord or triad.
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