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Old 12-17-2017, 03:04 AM   #1
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Default Playing Along With Originals

I really don't play along with the originals very often as I usually do covers and go from there but when I do, there is something that bugs the hell out of me. Ive noticed this with a lot of Beatle songs and just today with Fortunate Son by Credence. So today with Fortunate Son I noticed that I my rhythm kept falling behind Fogerty and vocals, even when I tried to speed up, it seemed that his vocals got ahead of me. So I went to youtube and found a few cover versions and I was spot on with those guys. Have noticed this a lot. Anyone know why?
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Old 12-17-2017, 03:25 AM   #2
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I'll hazard a good guess- you're not locking into the bass player, or drums. Vocal phrasing isn't always on the beat. If you're paying attention to the vocals only, you'll feel out of time. It's not likely the bass/drums are out of time; they're normally the metronome of the band. A vocalist is like a lead guitarist- they play over the top of the rhythm, and can be behind, ahead, or on the beat.

When you go to a YT how-to, there's no vocals to be distracted by.

I just listened to Fortunate Son- the vocals isn't always on the beat. Tap your foot to the bass, you're gonna see a lot of beginning vocal phrases start just as your foot comes up.
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Old 12-17-2017, 03:42 AM   #3
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Here's the music- you don't have to know how to read music. It's a visual representation of what I'm talking about.

Look at the first word "SOME"- there's an 1/8th note rest just before that. When you look below, where the bass is, it started on the beat. https://www.musicnotes.com/sheetmusi...?ppn=MN0108034 So most phrases start off the beat.
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Old 12-17-2017, 12:26 PM   #4
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Try listening with headphones. I hear some things better when I use headphones.
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Old 12-17-2017, 05:33 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silimtao View Post
I'll hazard a good guess- you're not locking into the bass player, or drums. Vocal phrasing isn't always on the beat. If you're paying attention to the vocals only, you'll feel out of time. It's not likely the bass/drums are out of time; they're normally the metronome of the band. A vocalist is like a lead guitarist- they play over the top of the rhythm, and can be behind, ahead, or on the beat.

When you go to a YT how-to, there's no vocals to be distracted by.

I just listened to Fortunate Son- the vocals isn't always on the beat. Tap your foot to the bass, you're gonna see a lot of beginning vocal phrases start just as your foot comes up.
I think you are probably on the right track. I went back to Fortunate Son and was spot on now. And probably part of the problem is that I never play "with" or "along" with anyone at all. Just myself. I really need to work on that a bit.
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Old 12-18-2017, 05:02 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silimtao View Post
I'll hazard a good guess- you're not locking into the bass player, or drums. Vocal phrasing isn't always on the beat. If you're paying attention to the vocals only, you'll feel out of time. It's not likely the bass/drums are out of time; they're normally the metronome of the band. A vocalist is like a lead guitarist- they play over the top of the rhythm, and can be behind, ahead, or on the beat.

When you go to a YT how-to, there's no vocals to be distracted by.

I just listened to Fortunate Son- the vocals isn't always on the beat. Tap your foot to the bass, you're gonna see a lot of beginning vocal phrases start just as your foot comes up.
This is actually one a big part of the concepts behind Robbie's 'Power Phrasing' course. When we did the workshop, he had everyone play their phrases starting in every part of the measure. 1, and of 1, 2, and of 2, 3, and of 3...
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Old 12-18-2017, 09:02 AM   #7
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Slim is bang on i think. If your playing rhythm you need to sit in with the rhythm section.
Lead parts be it guitar or vocals or whatever are playing over that rhythm.
If your mid song and you loose your rhythm it is the drums you will more then likely focus it on to get back in time not vocals.
The vocals well tell you where you are in the song but tight with the bass n drums is what makes a good tight rhythm player.
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Old 12-18-2017, 02:02 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobalt View Post
I think you are probably on the right track. I went back to Fortunate Son and was spot on now. And probably part of the problem is that I never play "with" or "along" with anyone at all. Just myself. I really need to work on that a bit.
Keeping in time with other musicians is a skill in and of itself. It's not necessarily hard, you just have to practice it just like any other skill. Before you know it, you won't even think about it. The fact that you are noticing that it is an issue is important too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abo View Post
Slim is bang on i think. If your playing rhythm you need to sit in with the rhythm section.
Lead parts be it guitar or vocals or whatever are playing over that rhythm.
If your mid song and you loose your rhythm it is the drums you will more then likely focus it on to get back in time not vocals.
The vocals well tell you where you are in the song but tight with the bass n drums is what makes a good tight rhythm player.
Yes. When I sense or hear my timing going off, I refocus on listening to what I'm playing over. Sometimes that involves closing my eyes, or looking up or down. You don't have this luxury over a backing track, but I've found myself watching the drummer hit his snare to get a lock on the groove.
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Old 12-18-2017, 02:16 PM   #9
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I tend to lock into the bass, as I often space out, and if I wander too far, I have some sense of what chord I should be on lol.
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Old 12-18-2017, 02:35 PM   #10
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I always lock in with the snare drum. Playing with a band involves skills that playing alone doesn't and vice versa.
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